Building My 1st Custom Pair / A Few Questions
I've been skating a lot more recently and am treating myself with a new pair of skates. I'm size 12 and supply seems very limited on the models I was gravitating to so building from the ground up is the direction I'm headed.
In the past I would just buy what the skate shop at the rink had in my size.
All this has landed me here (skate debate.com) and I welcome any comments for guidance.
A LITTLE INFO/ SKATING STYLE: I've always I enjoy laid back rhythm/dance style skating /spins and slides. I have always admired couples skating too. I don't get into crazy extreme acrobatics or hyper aggressive styles (flips/splits) . I am not set on one boot style, eventually wouldn't be opposed to building more than one pair. This stuff is so addicting! I've always skated a classic Chicago or similar boot. What I'm starting to narrow it down to now are both VNLA, The Godfather and The Blackout. Very different but equally intriguing. I'm ready for a change, plus I honestly cant find a nice classic leather or suede boot in my size. I'm not trying to skimp on quality but also am not a professional so would like to keep the total package around 600-800hund max. One last thing, leather is a must.
MY QUESTIONS:
My main question is... When you get a skate boot are there holes or hardware spots or marks in place to align the plate properly and how do you know the size of plate to put on the size of boot based on the type of skating I described above?
How to decide which plate is best for which boot? For instance, can the same plate be applied to either a very tall boot as well as a low/ shoe style boot?
My feet are wide, is there a wide boot out there? Seems like the VNLA V Line is wider but cant find size 12.
I'd like to be a little lower to the ground. What are the best ways to do this? Plates/hardware or wheels, or both?
Ultimately I will be spending my time at the rink but am going to be rolling around outside too. Does that mean two pairs or can switching the wheels do the trick? I understand in the end this comes down to how much money you want to spend. If I had to guess people who skate a lot of both indoor and outdoor probably have a pair for each. It seems like there is no one way and factors like plates and bearings also play factor.
What's an excellent wheel for wood rink which allows you to slide but also has some grip so its not just slipping and sliding all night. I'm a little unclear with the subtleties on the various FLOMAC'S
What is an excellent outdoor wheel for the type of skating I described above?
Is there one end all bearing that works for both indoor and outdoor?
It's going to be a process and I understand this will be a little trial and error but could use some help.
ALL MY GRATITUDE, THANK YOU!
Comments
My main question is... When you get a skate boot are there holes or hardware spots or marks in place to align the plate properly and how do you know the size of plate to put on the size of boot based on the type of skating I described above?
Unfortunately, no. I have only ever seen one kind of boot that was marked and I did not agree with where it was marked. There in lies the rub. Plate alignment is an art. Over the years, I have come to understand that aligning the plate to the boots is a fools errand if you are seeking optimum performance. One must align the plate to the foot inside. If you are familiar with the Brannock Device used by many shoe stores, you know about the arch length (Distance from heel to ball of foot) measurement. This measurement is used differently for sk8 boots than regular shoes but it provides the key to a proper front axle placement. The majority of sk8s are built assuming the ball of the foot is located at the widest part of the boot. If this was the case the arch length measurement would serve no purpose in shoes or sk8s. However human feet are all different and the length of the toes can vary greatly for any given shoe size. So the length of toes actually determines where the ball of the foot winds up in the boots. Long toes generally place the ball to the rear of the widest part of the boot, short ones to the front of the widest part.
In summary, using the widest part of the boot as the locator for the front axle is not the best way to go.
How to decide which plate is best for which boot? For instance, can the same plate be applied to either a very tall boot as well as a low/ shoe style boot?
Sure can. I have put many many "art" plates on speed boots. I'll be honest here, I prefer the short speed boots to both sk8 in and work on. Never really got into the big heels. Tried but it was one of my personal sk8ing failures.
My feet are wide, is there a wide boot out there? Seems like the VNLA V Line is wider but cant find size 12.
How wide?? Back to the Brannock device. Truly wide feet, say E and above require a special build. Face it large wide feet do not typically fall into the standard production range of off the shelf boots in any style. Bont and Riedell both build to accommodate any width you need but it is not inexpensive.
I'd like to be a little lower to the ground. What are the best ways to do this? Plates/hardware or wheels, or both?
I have never understood this "lower to the ground". The differences in plate height through the various brands is not much. Wheel diameter can get you lower. NOTE: shorter height plates generally produce more wheel bite when asked to edge deeply.
Ultimately I will be spending my time at the rink but am going to be rolling around outside too. Does that mean two pairs or can switching the wheels do the trick?
Yes and a lot of sk8rs do it.
I understand in the end this comes down to how much money you want to spend. If I had to guess people who skate a lot of both indoor and outdoor probably have a pair for each. It seems like there is no one way and factors like plates and bearings also play factor.
No one way for certain. I have plenty of customers that do it both ways. As far as bearings?? I don't much believe in 99% of the bearing lore out there. If you want an excellent bullet proof sk8 bearing, nothing tops the old 37K (7mm) of 38K (8mm) 8 ball Fafnirs. They are very hard to find new and even good used ones run 100.00 or more.
What's an excellent wheel for wood rink which allows you to slide but also has some grip so its not just slipping and sliding all night. I'm a little unclear with the subtleties on the various FLOMAC'S
Fomacs?? Anyway, what wheel questions are essentially "How high is up??" questions. This will require getting to know folks that sk8 where you sk8 and pursue the style/s you want to enjoy. Here is a tip. When one has a sk8 with a tunable suspension, it can be used to change the way wheels perform on a given floor.
What is an excellent outdoor wheel for the type of skating I described above?
See above.
Is there one end all bearing that works for both indoor and outdoor?
The previously mentioned Fafnirs work well. The Sure Grip 8 ball Qubes also work well for a lot less money.
Hope this helps.
I appreciate you insight
Still super torn on which plates to buy
I'lll keep researching.
OK I'll drop ya a hint. Roll Line. Great plates but parts are grotesquely pricey.
Yeah thats what I've landed on after hours of deliberation , I'm thinking Mistrels. Pricey but I still haven't read one negative review. The expensive parts you mention, do they need replacing often? Are there specific parts you are referring to? These plates seem quality and for the high price I figured they would be extremely durable.
I'm thinking 200 size for size 12 boot (vnla godfather), a little concerned 200 could be on the larger size. Not sure if sizing down would be something I'd prefer in the end? Seems like sizing down is a thing but would 190 or say even 180 on a size 12 boot be too small/way too small?
Also do roll line plates come with mounting hardware and all the other nuts and washers for the trucks?
Also Also I'm guessing a 5/8 plug is what I'll use.
All these questions I have don't really have clear answers and the world of skate building is a little cryptic online.
Thanks again DocSk8!
Yeah thats what I've landed on after hours of deliberation , I'm thinking Mistrels. Pricey but I still haven't read one negative review. The expensive parts you mention, do they need replacing often? Are there specific parts you are referring to? These plates seem quality and for the high price I figured they would be extremely durable.
Durable, yes. The expensive parts are cushions in the suspension. For example One can purchase the full set of Sure Grip Supers (all 4 durometers) for the same money as one set of Roll LInes. My entire experience with Roll Lines has (Variants, Mistrals, Giottos, Rings and Matrix) I have always ignored Roll Line's recommended cushion for my weight (anywhere between 170 and 240 over the years) and run the softest green cushions.
I'm thinking 200 size for size 12 boot (vnla godfather), a little concerned 200 could be on the larger size. Not sure if sizing down would be something I'd prefer in the end? Seems like sizing down is a thing but would 190 or say even 180 on a size 12 boot be too small/way too small?
Yeah kinda long in my book. The longest any plate I have put on a 12 was a 7.5" ~ a 190mm. I have a customer who runs 7.25" ~ 185mm on 14s. The vast majority of my customers run them 1/2 to 3/4" shorter than recommended. You could run a 180mm on a 12 w/ no problem. Note: I know very little about those boots. I only saw some pre production samples about a year and a half ago.
Also do roll line plates come with mounting hardware and all the other nuts and washers for the trucks?
They do. Be aware they use true 7mm X1 axle nuts. Most rinks don't carry them. DO NOT use the American 7mm axle nut as it is a 9/32 x 32 tp1 and will wreck your axles if they are forced on.
Also Also I'm guessing a 5/8 plug is what I'll use.
Yes a plastic 5/8 plug will work but you best put some silicone spray on the threads when you put it in. The metric thread in the Roll Line stop hole is close and the plastic threads on the plug will deform OK. DO NOT use an IRIS plug w/ a metal shank. That will cause a calamity.
All these questions I have don't really have clear answers and the world of skate building is a little cryptic online.
Of course it is. That's because there are way too many ways to approach things and may sk8rs suffer from the Dunning-Kruger Effect and get on social media to share their new found "expertise". For that matter there are other "experts" that have never tried more than one way of doing things... Not good. BTW I am a Roll Line dealer. Drop me an email and we can get ya going.
Thanks, that's very helpful.
Can't get why these skate companies don't get a little more detailed on specks. I don't need pages of information just a few basic measurements and parts lists. Also, VNLA just says the boots run big and most people size down which makes it even more unpredictable. Been size 12 for over two decades and never once had to size down, always up. Its practically impossible to try in person unless you are in a select metropolitan area. I took my chances and went with 12. I'll report back.
I had a suspicion the 200 plate would be a big, I think I may wait until I receive the boot and can actually measure it. Will do 190 but am enticed with 180 option as I see the desire for a more compact footprint. I'll need to have something to go off first to compare though.
How often should the average skater change their cushions? After a certain amount of hours? Or once a certain amount of apparent wear is present?
Looks like ballpark cushion options are in the $20-40 range for all 8.
The low end price is the 3 different durometers of rubber. The high end price is for the 5 different urethane sets. Buying cushions is NOT just about replacing worn parts. It's about finding out what works best for you. I cannot count the number of times I have upgraded a sk8rs cushions and watched them essentially lose it when they roll them. They cannot believe how much better the new suspension works. Tuning for optimum performance is all part of the game.
Makes sense.
The cleaner and greasier your bearing, the better it will rotate. In addition to sand and dirt, the roadways are also loaded with puddles and sludge. This affects the rolling action of the bearings. Properly lubricating bearings will ensure that does not get stuck due to bearing friction the next time you wake up and want to skate.
Douglullabies, I think you have your eyes on some good gear. The VLNA Godfather does run large. I know several skaters who use that boot. You will have a much easier time finding flat (derby style) boots without a heel in size 12. The Sure Grip boots such as the GT-50 have some of the widest widths for the ball and toe-box, but they are flat skates. The cheap Sure Grip Fame boots go to 12 and they have a heel. The quality is middling, but the boots are super cheap and available. I'm assuming because you are looking at the Godfather, you want a heel (I know I do). I started off on flat skates then migrated to using skates with a heel. I much prefer them for dance, but for not for trail skating. Jackson's have a wider toe box, but are normal width around the ball. Gam skates have big wide toe boxes, but they are full-custom and hard to work with. Harlick has wide options, but they are super pricey. Another less expensive option that gets you working with a pro-bootist is Golden Horse Skates will sell you "just boots" too. They require a lot of measurements and 14 different pictures, but I consider that a good thing. I haven't got any personal experience with them, yet. I was going to try and get a set of customs from them, soon, though. I have a Snyder plate I need to mount on a good boot. Also, when it comes to mounting a plate, Docsk8 probably has more experience than me, but I've done a few dozen mounts. I'd agree with everything Doc said, but I'll give you some more info from my own experience. What I concentrate on is two main things: heel position and keeping the directional forward alignment of the plate correct. This, of course, assumes you are following the manufacturer's instructions and you aren't doing some kind of custom short-forward or other special mount. I do a post about my mounting method and maybe Doc or others can comment on my technique and give some more pointers.
For beginners, stepping into the wider world of skateboarding is a daunting prospect. From choosing the right deck for my style to selecting trucks and wheels, and from learning kickflips to rock drops, there is a lot to learn. Most folks have to learn this the hard way.